'Bad officers make it hard for the good ones': Senator Menendez

New Jersey Senator Bob Menendez joins Yahoo Finance’s On The Move to weigh in on police reform and address how the state is using its funding in response to the COVID-19 pandemic.

Video Transcript

JULIE HYMAN: I'm Julie Hyman. This is "On the Move" on Yahoo Finance. I'm alongside my co-anchor, Adam Shapiro, as well as my colleagues Dan Roberts and Melody Hahm, as well as Jessica Smith, who is going to join us for this next conversation. Senator Bob Menendez, Democrat of New Jersey, is joining us now.

Senator Menendez, just a reminder to unmute yourself so we can have this conversation now. And Senator, I know that you are a co-sponsor on a bill that is aimed at police reform. It's called the Justice in Policing Act. And as we talk about the life of George Floyd and talk about the others who have been victims of police brutality, I want to know, for you, in that bill, what is really the priority? Not just the spirit of the bill, but specifically, what do you think is most urgent to accomplish right now?

BOB MENENDEZ: Well, I think it's to change the future course of events in a way that no one will ever lose their life like George Floyd did. And that means the standards for police officers to follow a universal standard against excessive force. A universal registry to ensure that those who commit misconduct, police misconduct, can't just transfer to another job in another state and then have the possibility of misconduct there. The police training of that is called for. And also the liability standards, I think, make a very clear statement as to what you should and should not do and what your obligation is as an officer.

Listen, officers overwhelmingly, I think, are good, law-abiding. They have a tough job. But at the end of the day, those who are bad officers end up making it harder for all the other ones. This sets a very clear set of standards that we need to follow.

ADAM SHAPIRO: Senator, Adam Shapiro. Thank you for joining us. We've had proposals in the past to create a national registry and to track the kinds of abuses that most people find reprehensible. So what's going to change this time? And who across the aisle is joining Democrats for this reform?

BOB MENENDEZ: Well, I know that my colleague, Senator Cory Booker, is in some serious discussions with a few Republicans. I'll look forward to them hopefully joining us. I understand that some of them are making some of their own proposals. We'll see what they are.

I think what's different is that there is a movement nationally. There was a poll that came out today that over 66% of Americans across the spectrum believe that these abuses exist and that they need to ultimately be reformed. So the voices of the people, I think, are going to drive. Just like civil rights movement, there came a moment. The Voting Rights Act came a moment. I think this is a moment for the type of police reform we're talking about.

JESSICA SMITH: Senator, Jessica Smith here in Washington. We also wanted to talk to you about a hearing that's happening this afternoon. We have the secretary of labor testifying before the Senate Finance Committee. You're on that committee. What do you think needs to happen going forward when the enhanced unemployment benefits are set to expire on the 31st? And how do you think that the jobs report that we had on Friday that was better than expected impacts this debate? Because we're already hearing from some Republicans who say this program should not be expanded going forward.

BOB MENENDEZ: Well, you know, the fact that some states are beginning to reopen doesn't guarantee that there's going to be employment. If you're among the 13.3% who are unemployed, that isn't solace to you. If you are among the 17.6% of Latinos who are unemployed, that is no solace to you. If you're among the 16.8% percent of African-Americans who are unemployed, that isn't solace to you.

I want to know from the secretary, what's your plan for August 1 when the enhanced benefits expire and people who have been furloughed and/or laid off ultimately do not have a job to return to? What is your plan for August 1? And to believe that somehow magically by August 1 we're going to have a universe-- not have a universe of very significant numbers of people in our country who are unemployed and for which we will have expired these benefits. You don't wait till then to figure it out.

So I want to hear what the secretary's plan in that regard is. And I also want to hear from the secretary, why is it that when there have been 5,000 OSHA complaints and only one violation issued, that the department has not issued emergency temporary standards for workers to understand what is the safe standards under which they should return to work? Those are some of the critical questions I want to pose and I hope we'll hear some answers about.

JESSICA SMITH: We've heard some Republicans present a back-to-work bonus as an alternative, maybe. Do you think there is some sort of a compromise, whether it be lowering that $600 and doing the back-to-work bonus? Is there any kind of middle ground that you see that could be a path forward?

BOB MENENDEZ: Like everything, it depends how in fact it is devised. I certainly am open to thinking about that possibility. I don't want people to be on unemployment. I want people to be gainfully employed. That's what we want.

But in my home state of New Jersey, by way of example, where we have 1.2 million New Jerseyans who are unemployed, you know, we are going through phases of reopening. Unfortunately, we had the highest rates-- second highest rates of coronavirus deaths in our state. Over 12,000 fellow New Jerseyans have been lost. Over 160,000 so far have been listed as infected.

And so as these phases unlock, the question is, I'm not sure that on August 1 we're going to be in the full phase of where we get back to a new normal. I'm not sure that people will be fully offered jobs. So the question is not, do we want people to go back to work or not. Of course we do. But when they are not offered a job, when there are no standards to determine whether you can go back to a job that is offered to you safely, then those are open questions.

So I'm open to hearing about what's a-- if they have an idea for a different pathway forward. Certainly open to listen to it, but there must be a pathway. And what I'm afraid of is that August 1 will come, and we will have millions of Americans who just simply won't have any pathway whatsoever.

JULIE HYMAN: And Senator, what do you think the appetite is, in addition to that, for not just unemployment insurance to continue, but also the stimulus checks that Americans have been receiving and the Paycheck Protection Program that small business owners have had access to, but which has obviously had to be renewed because it ran out?

BOB MENENDEZ: Well, I think if you listen to Senator McConnell and my Republican colleagues, there's not much of an appetite, as they describe, for doing anything as a "COVID four." And if so, they seek to constrain it. One of the elements, I think, that has to be in any COVID legislation-- Moody's Analytics and others, the National Governors Association, have said that if states and municipalities don't get assistance, we will have literally thousands of public safety employees-- firefighters, police officers, paramedics, teachers, and others-- laid off, which will only be a further drag on the economy. And it would be the height of irony that at the end of the day, those who we needed the most during this pandemic and any potential rebound of one in the future would be the ones that would be laid off.

And so, you know, this $500 billion program that Senator Cassidy, Republican from Louisiana, and I, along with other Republicans and Democrats, have offered for state and municipalities need to be part of such a future COVID package. And as it relates to stimulus for individuals as well, I'm certainly open to that. My colleagues seem want to constrain it and see what happens.

But if you can't make your rent payment, if you can't meet your mortgage payment, and your time for forbearance has gone by, if the business that you were working at is no longer fully reopened to full capacity, that's another question. Reopening doesn't mean it's everything goes back to normal. There'll be different capacities. Well, what is your option? And if municipalities and states who have lost dramatic revenue because of the very difficult social distancing measures necessary to starve the virus of being able to spread, all of the consequences of revenues that have been lost by state and municipalities and the services that are provided to constituents cannot take place. Then we have a recipe for disaster. I don't think--

ADAM SHAPIRO: Senator? How do you convince Republicans? And we know that Republican-controlled legislatures have not funded public pensions to the same degree that Democratic-controlled legislatures have not done that. How do you tell people, say, in Florida, that doesn't have an income tax, that they should support the funding-- the federal government helping everybody out at the state and municipal level-- when people in Florida, some of them, moved there to avoid higher taxes like we might have in a place like New York or New Jersey or California?

BOB MENENDEZ: Well, I'd start off by saying, hey, my fellow Americans in Florida, you get $37 billion more than you pay to the federal treasury. So New Jerseyans, for example, send more money to the federal treasury than they get back. So this is one country. It's the reason we call it the "United" States of America.

And that's why, also, we see a growing number of Republicans who are beginning to realize that revenue losses, infection rates are affecting them as well. Which is why we have, among others, our colleague, Senator Hyde-Smith from Mississippi, Senator Susan Collins from Maine, Senator Cassidy from Louisiana. That's a geographic and ideological diversity, I think, that speaks volumes of the need.

But I'd say to my colleagues from-- my one colleague from Florida, who seems to be so focused on this, I tell you what. Send us our $37 billion back, and we won't need any of your money.

JESSICA SMITH: Senator, I just had a quick question on the Paycheck Protection Program. I know you were pushing for more flexibility for business owners there. The president just signed that bill into law, giving business owners more time and a little more flexibility. Do you think there need to be further changes to the program? What do you make of it now that this bill is signed into law?

BOB MENENDEZ: Well, it's much better as a result of the bill that was signed into law. There are still a few things that the House did in the Heroes Act that I think are still worthy. I will just say that there are some industries-- for example, the restaurant, the catering industry, just by way of example, where the PPP program didn't quite work very well. And so we need to be thinking about some flexibility for some of these industries if, in fact, they're going to be recipients for which the money actually worked for them.

And so, you know, we're just-- in New Jersey, by way of example-- going to limited outdoor dining. Well, that's a far greater restriction than having all your employees on. And at the end of the day, not being able to open up fully, how does the PPP deal with that? How does the PPP deal with the tourism industry, which is a seasonal industry, about three-month industry, giving them some flexibility as well?

So I think we made some good progress. I think there are elements that still need to be considered to make the program fully effective for all the different elements of the private sector.

JULIE HYMAN: Senator Bob Menendez, Democrat of New Jersey. Sir, thank you for your time, and be well. And thanks to our Jessica Smith as well.

BOB MENENDEZ: Thank you. Stay safe, everybody.